Zen Culture vs Western Buddhist/Evangelical Christians: Authoritarian Infantilism

Anybody who visits this forum for the first time will notice lots of posts from people who quote texts and cite sources, and lots of vote brigading from people who can't or won't. This is a clash of cultures! Let's look at the cultural differences behind this.

1. Zen Masters expect you to know the history of Zen... Western Buddhists and Evangelical Christians don't know their own history.

   • Zen Masters wrote books of instruction based on dialogue with historical collections of historical records
   • Yuanwu famous explores the Four Statements of Zen at the beginning of BCR, underscoring the cultural aspect of lineage.
   • Western Buddhists famously don't know their catechism, let alone where it came from, let alone who wrote the text(s) it came from, let alone when. Evangelical Christians come out a little better, but not much, because their history is just the church version.

2. Zen Masters cite sources.... Western Buddhists and Evangelical Christians can't.

   • The original real Shobogenzo, approved by Zen Master Dahui, is collection of citations. Dahui adds very little to this historical record... the focus is clearly on citing sources. But notice that all Zen Cases start with names. That's not an accident, that's culture.
   • Western Buddhists and Evangelical Christians aren't encouraged to learn the names of the people in their historical record... just the messiahs. Who were the big 7th century Christian thinkers? Evangelical Christians don't know. Who wrote the sutras about Buddha-Jesus? Western Buddhists don't know who, when, or even where.

3. Zen Masters insist on direct engagement with history and citations... Western Buddhists and Evangelical Christians are told what to think by gurus and churches.

   • 46) One day, when Yün-chü was doing garden work, he accidentally chopped an earthworm. Soto Zen Master Dongshan said, "Watch out!" "It didn't die," said Yün-chü. "What about when the Second Patriarch went to Yeh-chou?" said the Master.
     • The second patriarch was lynched by Buddhists in Yeh-chou.
   • Western Buddhists don't engage in a lively debate about what sutras mean, or which ones are more authentic. If you don't believe me, go look at r/Buddhism or r/ZenBuddhism. Evangelical Christians didn't figure out the flood story wasn't from the bible... they were blindsided because they do not engage directly with history.

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^Yo͞ok  Welcome! ^{Meet me}  My comment: Authoritarian means you don't think for yourself, the authority thinks for you. Infantilsm means you aren't psychologically and philosophically mature enough to engage with the source on your own.

r/Zen seems to very much carry on the Zen tradition of direct engagement... which explains why people who come in here from Authoritarian Infantilizing Western Buddhism are so angry about having their nose rubbed in books, philosophical questions, and ethical problems (like [Western Buddhism's history of sex predators](www.reddit.com/r/zen/wiki/sexpredators)). Western Buddhists haven't been prepared to think for themselves or to measure their own mental maturity. Their religion is about believing not playing with the Light of Mind.

Blaming them is the same as condemning their entire culture.

Submitted May 05, 2023 at 04:46AM by ewk https://ift.tt/EVReHsx